Sign in or 
Location: NCIS MODERATORS' BLOG 115
Discussion: Gibbs and Ziva
Category:
Discussion Forum /
General Discussion
Share this
MargyW |
Gibbs and Ziva
Sep 7 2010, 4:46 PM EDT
My blog entry for today:http://www.ncisfanwiki.com/page/NCIS+MODERATORS%27+BLOG+115 I would appreciate your comments. Do you find this valuable?
Keyword tags:
Leroy Jethro Gibbs
NCIS Moderators Blog
Ziva David
|
gottahavemyncis |
1. RE: Gibbs and Ziva
Sep 7 2010, 5:38 PM EDT
| Post edited: Sep 7 2010, 5:41 PM EDT
Yes, Ziva clearly looks at Gibbs as father figure, as you've quoted her - and just reading that brings a lump to my throat remembering that scene...and yet there's been so much controversy about Ziva, whether she's trustworthy now...how Gibbs could forgive her for her omissions &/or lies. Is it that their relationship is stronger than the questions? Parent & child - there can be mistrust & problems but that doesn't mean a parent stops loving a child or vice versa. Is that it with them....no matter what? Gibbs in the basement & in the interrogation room, listens to what she says and accepts it. Certainly Ziva's deep need for family and for Gibbs is heartrending and I trust that is real, no matter what. So maybe that's all Gibbs really needed.
Do you find this valuable?
|
tara_persad |
2. RE: Gibbs and Ziva
Sep 7 2010, 11:25 PM EDT
| Post edited: Sep 7 2010, 11:26 PM EDT
"My blog entry for today:I totally agree with you Margy. It was sort of poetic how you described Gibbs and Ziva. Ziva do indeed considers Gibbs as her father. And that hug she gave him in season 6, it said something about their father daughter relationship; it was like she was separated from her father for a long time or something happened to him (Gibbs) and she was more than happy to see him again. We would never see something like that between Eli and Ziva :( I also agree with Gottahave, Gibbs considered Ziva part of his family, that's why he gave Ziva another chance, that's why he let Ziva tell her side of the story. Yes, what Ziva did was wrong, lying to Gibbs and having him choose between her and Tony; but Ziva Gibbs he sort of thought like her father, and Ziva was his daughter - giving her another chance instead of just forgetting about her. IMO, Gibbs and Ziva's sort of father daughter relationship is unique and strong if they could go through all of what they went through, forgive each other and look the other way. And the part about Gibbs missing her ceremony, I just really hope there is something - a talk or anything! between Gibbs and Ziva about why he missed it. Lol, I still can't believe Ziva expected Gibbs to choose between her and Tony. Did she really think there was a chance that Gibbs would choose her instead of Tony of all people? Like what was she thinking?! I am always shocked whenever I think about how Ziva gave Gibbs that choice....... Do you find this valuable? |
a_giblet |
3. RE: Gibbs and Ziva
Sep 8 2010, 7:53 PM EDT
Hi MargW,Pardon my correction to your quote but in "Reunion" when Gibbs confronts Ziva about Ari, she says "Eli is all but dead to me" I've seen that episode so many times I can see it in my sleep (thank goodness for DVR's) Their relationship is more like father/daughter than Gibbs/Abby is. He trusts her - once she explained the Ari situation to him, that old trust was back despite what happened in future episodes involving the Damacles. He just had to show her some tough love along the way but in the end, just as she has had for him, he had her back. One of my favorite scenes in S7 was in Child's Play when they're outside the mothers house and Ziva lines up her sites on the bad guy...Gibbs asks the girl what the probability of Ziva making the shot and when that guy pulls back the hammer on his gun, one word to Ziva and he's dead. That's trust. Gibbs trusts Ziva as a person, as an agent and in any other imaginable way. A great relationship that just gets stronger as time passes. 1 out of 2 found this valuable. Do you? |
|
gottahavemyncis |
4. RE: Gibbs and Ziva
Sep 8 2010, 8:59 PM EDT
"Tara, sorry, deleting parts of yr post. I don't think we'll get an answer but I'm not happy at Gibbs missing Ziva's ceremony either. As for why Ziva tried to get Gibbs to make a choice - IMO she was out of her head with grief, anger & confusion & rather desperate at that point. Her request was clearly not something she'd thought through, she was out of control..at least her emotions were and logic had fled. If you watch the scene - in episode GCBC maybe? - in the basement where she goes to Gibbs; now she understands what happened. Sigh, that poor girl, so glad she's got Gibbs & her team! Do you find this valuable? |
Det.Beckett |
5. RE: Gibbs and Ziva
Sep 8 2010, 9:42 PM EDT
One of my favorites of your blogs, MargyW. I never thought about it that way, but I like the idea that Gibbs was worried about Tony & Tim taking Ziva's position as an affront. Best line: Gibbs knows that Ziva can take it. Kind of sums up their whole relationship to me. He lets her kill Ari (even if he hadn't been her brother, killing a co-worker isn't easy either), he headslaps her unlike Kate or Abby, and in "Aliyah" he lets Vance and Eli play their games, even though he doesn't like it. Do you find this valuable? |
|
MargyW |
6. RE: Gibbs and Ziva
Sep 8 2010, 10:45 PM EDT
"One of my favorites of your blogs, MargyW. I never thought about it that way, but I like the idea that Gibbs was worried about Tony & Tim taking Ziva's position as an affront.Thank you. :) Do you find this valuable? |
bellswebster |
7. RE: Gibbs and Ziva
Sep 9 2010, 12:01 AM EDT
When Ziva was saying I can't work with Tony, she may not have been asking Gibbs to make a choice. She had already made it for herself and Gibbs just kissed her goodbye because he knew she had made up her mind and she wasn't coming home with him. I can understand how she must have felt...she wasn't ready to forgive or forget. Can't help wonder if her father may have influenced her decision to stay. He may have told her she WAS staying...after all he wanted her to take over Michaels place. And I don't know if they went to save Ziva as they didn't even know if she was alive or not. Tony was insistant to go and see, and he was shocked when he saw her sitting in front of him. If I was being framed for murder I wouldn't go to my father because I woudn't want to get him involved. I would ask the best person in that field to help..which for Ziva was Gibbs. You can see that they are close..and yes, she views Gibbs as a father figure. But there have been no references, after that hug on returning, to the two of them spending time together as a father and daughter would.1 out of 1 found this valuable. Do you? |
|
MargyW |
8. RE: Gibbs and Ziva
Sep 9 2010, 1:07 AM EDT
"When Ziva was saying I can't work with Tony, she may not have been asking Gibbs to make a choice. She had already made it for herself and Gibbs just kissed her goodbye because he knew she had made up her mind and she wasn't coming home with him. I can understand how she must have felt...she wasn't ready to forgive or forget. Can't help wonder if her father may have influenced her decision to stay. He may have told her she WAS staying...after all he wanted her to take over Michaels place. And I don't know if they went to save Ziva as they didn't even know if she was alive or not. Tony was insistant to go and see, and he was shocked when he saw her sitting in front of him. If I was being framed for murder I wouldn't go to my father because I woudn't want to get him involved. I would ask the best person in that field to help..which for Ziva was Gibbs. You can see that they are close..and yes, she views Gibbs as a father figure. But there have been no references, after that hug on returning, to the two of them spending time together as a father and daughter would.No. She told Gibbs that if she came back she or Tony would have to be transferred off the team. She was forcing Gibbs to make a choice. 1 out of 1 found this valuable. Do you? |
HardKore71 |
9. RE: Gibbs and Ziva
Sep 9 2010, 2:39 AM EDT
"No. She told Gibbs that if she came back she or Tony would have to be transferred off the team. She was forcing Gibbs to make a choice."Great blog topic, you know I've been hard on Ziva for the last few months or so...I gotta agree with Bells and Ducky, yes she gave Gibbs that ultimatum, but she knew that Gibbs would never transfer DiNozzo, she forced him to play his hand. Do you find this valuable? |
emerellda |
10. RE: Gibbs and Ziva
Sep 9 2010, 3:13 AM EDT
"When Ziva was saying I can't work with Tony, she may not have been asking Gibbs to make a choice. She had already made it for herself and Gibbs just kissed her goodbye because he knew she had made up her mind and she wasn't coming home with him. I can understand how she must have felt...she wasn't ready to forgive or forget. Can't help wonder if her father may have influenced her decision to stay. He may have told her she WAS staying...after all he wanted her to take over Michaels place. And I don't know if they went to save Ziva as they didn't even know if she was alive or not. Tony was insistant to go and see, and he was shocked when he saw her sitting in front of him. If I was being framed for murder I wouldn't go to my father because I woudn't want to get him involved. I would ask the best person in that field to help..which for Ziva was Gibbs. You can see that they are close..and yes, she views Gibbs as a father figure. But there have been no references, after that hug on returning, to the two of them spending time together as a father and daughter would.to me gibbs and ziva don't need to spend time together like a father and daughter, because they both know that they have this strong relationship, and as the very interor and confinned people that they are, they almost don't like to show it, or acknowledge its esitance, they show the strength of there relationship in other ways, like ziva going to gibbs to ask for his blessing, this to me is what differentiates the relationship between gibbs and tony, which they acknowledge the esitance of more, like tony going over to gibbs' house Do you find this valuable? |
stephaniesanders18 |
11. RE: Gibbs and Ziva
Sep 9 2010, 8:03 AM EDT
i like ziva and Gibbs being together they make a really good father and daughter role in ncis. i agree with everyone you there that she had made her own mind up to stay in Israel and she was just letting Gibbs know her decision. when i watched the first episode of season seven i was really excited i think that tony felt that he needed to help ziva as the team kept saying there is no i in team and they are all a team and that counts for something, there could also be that everyone in that team classes as family and even though Kate has gone out of it she will stay as part of the team.
Do you find this valuable?
|
|
FFFrog |
12. RE: Gibbs and Ziva
Sep 9 2010, 10:31 AM EDT
"i agree with everyone you there that she had made her own mind up to stay in Israel and she was just letting Gibbs know her decision. "According to Shane Brenan in an interview he gave around this time last year she was intending to return and was very surprised to be left in Israel. I've always been a little perplexed by the father daughter bit. Ziva said that she considered Gibbs as a father but I've not really seen anything from him that suggests he does regard her in that way. 1 out of 1 found this valuable. Do you? |
|
gottahavemyncis |
13. RE: Gibbs and Ziva
Sep 9 2010, 4:12 PM EDT
"According to Shane Brenan in an interview he gave around this time last year she was intending to return and was very surprised to be left in Israel. I've always been a little perplexed by the father daughter bit. Ziva said that she considered Gibbs as a father but I've not really seen anything from him that suggests he does regard her in that way."Interesting point FFFrog...not sure Gibbs would ever acknowledge that for any of his team. So far, I don't believe Gibbs has ever said anything to anyone about being a "father figure" to Ziva, Tony or Abby. There is truth, however, in the saying that actions speak louder than words. Do you find this valuable? |
|
MargyW |
14. RE: Gibbs and Ziva
Sep 9 2010, 4:24 PM EDT
"Interesting point FFFrog...not sure Gibbs would ever acknowledge that for any of his team. So far, I don't believe Gibbs has ever said anything to anyone about being a "father figure" to Ziva, Tony or Abby. There is truth, however, in the saying that actions speak louder than words. "Exactly. It's his attitude and his behavior towards them that shows him as a father figure. Do you find this valuable? |
|
Irishelf |
15. RE: Gibbs and Ziva
Sep 10 2010, 11:32 AM EDT
"Exactly. It's his attitude and his behavior towards them that shows him as a father figure."I agree. Especially when he exhibits what Ducky called tough love (in Ziva's case that would be in "Jeopardy", "Aliyah", and "GCBC"). Do you find this valuable? |
TrinaXO |
16. RE: Gibbs and Ziva
Sep 11 2010, 5:27 AM EDT
I think Gibbs respects the hell out of Ziva, but i really don't see it as a father daughter relationship at all. In fact I felt the whole Ziva seeing Gibbs as a father figure and saying as much was quite low and saw it as her playing the Daddy card so Gibbs would feel bad and take her back I mean seriously Gibbs with all his daughter issues and then Ziva's statement....Daddy card........ But in saying that I do think Gibbs respects Ziva, but I feel the trust that was so immediate in season 3 is no longer automatically there after the events of season 6 first part of 7 and Ziva will have to work to re-build regain that trust. Im not a huge fan of Gibbs and Ziva scenes (nothing to do with MH or CdP both are fantastic) as I feel that their character interaction relationship trust was built on one gigantic lie, but for some reason I do like the Ziva and McGee scenes there is a real sweetness in their interactions.
2
out of
2 found this valuable.
Do you?
|
|
bellswebster |
17. RE: Gibbs and Ziva
Sep 11 2010, 5:52 AM EDT
| Post edited: Sep 11 2010, 6:01 AM EDT
Sorry Trina, but I don't see Ziva playing the daddy card..that would make her sly and devious, and I don't see that in Ziva. I don't view Ziva and Gibbs as father /daughter anymore than I view Gibbs and Tony as father and son, nor Gibbs and Abby as father/ daughter. I do see Gibbs acting "fatherly" around his team, but I wouldn't say it constitutes the term of him "being a father" to them. Gibbs feels deeply for all his team but for different reasons. There is definatly "a bond of kind" with Ziva, Tony and Abby. Abby loves him more I feel. She shows it with actions, feelings and words. Ziva is "close" to Gibbs, and she may have said to him "You are the closest thing I have to a father, but Gibbs doesn't act like a father with her other than when she needs emotional support. Being a father-figure is "being there when you need parental type of advice', and you want to get if from someone you feel "close" too and have respect for their opinion. I have never heard or seen Gibbs and Ziva doing father/daughter things together...anymore than I have heard/seen of him and Abby doing father/daughter things. He "hangs out" with Tony sometimes.
2
out of
2 found this valuable.
Do you?
|
marion612 |
18. RE: Gibbs and Ziva
Sep 11 2010, 6:13 AM EDT
I do think Gibbs is the one who Ziva and Tony or Abby would come to if/when they need guidance and support (it seems to me that it is what Tony did in Flesh and blood and obsession).I remember him taking Abby out for her birthday which is something a father could do. But I do agree with bellswebster Gibbs is fatherly with them not really their father figure (if only because they are grown ups and don't really need one now no matter how screwed their reals fathers are). I do think Ziva considers Gibbs as someone older than her whose opinion she respects and who cares for her so she may see him as a father figure or at least wishes he was a father figure to her. I don't think she was truly being manipulative , she was just trying to make him see things the way she did and knowing Gibbs and his "daughter" issues she did use that to her adantage (IMO). On a different note, last night was the french version of Good cop, bad cop" , they dubbed what Gibbs whispered to Ziva , he said " vous n'avez pas à vous excuser, je vous pardonne" which means " you don't have to apologize, I forgive you", at one point in the episode he called her "tu" instead of what he calls her usually "vous" which is both most respectful and more distant (Tony, Kate , Ducky and Abby are on a "tu/tu" basis with Gibbs but Ziva and McGee are on a "vous/vous " basis with him. Do you find this valuable? |
|
gottahavemyncis |
19. RE: Gibbs and Ziva
Sep 11 2010, 3:11 PM EDT
interesting about the language use, marion. The use of "vous" ties in with what I've feared with Gibbs/McGee but it does surprise me with Gibbs & Ziva. Was it just that one episode or does Gibbs normally use the more familiar "tu" with Ziva?
Do you find this valuable?
|
